Harding's planned escape for McMurphy

Harding creates a plan for McMurphy to escape, but McMurphy decides to get some sleep before he has to go on a long ride with sandy and candy. McMurphy was more drunk than he thought and never woke up in time before the Black boys started their shift. Do you think this is the end for McMurphy and the Nurse decides to make him a chronic? Or Do you think McMurphy can pull off a miracle and break free from Nurse Ratched's death grip? The Nurse will do anything in her power to win the war over McMurphy but does she have the final answer that will promote her victory?

The Control Panel

The control panel is a recurring symbol throughout the book. I think it stands for strength and independence, just like McMurphy does, because Chief finally becomes strong enough (both mentally and physically) to lift it and use it to escape the ward. What do you think it symolizes?

Nurse Ratched & McMurphy's return

So I'm not sure if I missed something or not, but I'm a little confused.  At the end when Nurse Ratched comes back, why can't she talk and why does she all beat up and bruised?  Also why did McMurphy get a lobotomy and why is he also all beat up and bruised?  Like I said, I may have missed something...so if I did could someone explain.

Size

Everything in the Chiefs eyes before him getting healthier was realitive to him seeing everything in different sizes he thought everything andeveryone around was bigger than he was that is why he just acted deaf and dumb

Reading the last chapter of the book made me realize how much of an effect McMurphy has had on everyone in the ward.  McMuphy has such a great impact on them that even when he is not at the group meeting his presence is felt. Not only this but people are standing up to the nurse by going against her during the meetings and even yelling at her (Harding). Even though McMuphy is not physical alive I believe that his teachings live on through all men who have listened to him.  

Confidence

Everything Mcmurphy does is done with confidence this is to show the Big Nurse who the boss is in the ward. It is also used to show/teach the other paitents what confidence is and how to use it to thier advantage.

The Nurse's practices, treatment or torture?

Nurse Ratched definately does not have positive motives in mind when dealing with McMurphy. She has had enough with him , she is fed up and she is trying everything to stay in control and keep power at the ward. She uses shock treatment as more of a torture than an actual treatment. It is also very interesting that the little japanese nurse in the Disturbed Ward does not agree with the Big Nurse's practices. The doctor's seem like they want to fight back against her as well, for instance, the Doctor goes against the nurse and goes with the men on the fishing trip. The reason no one takes over is because they are afraid of her, she runs her entire Ward solely on fear. Mcmurphy is the first one to break down her barrier because he is not afraid of her.

The Combine

Throughout the novel the Chief has a hallucinatory fixation on "The Combine," the group he had imagined that tries to enforce order and control those that don't fit into society. The chief refers to them several times, always during a moment when he wasn't completely lucid. When the Chief starts becoming freed by McMurphy, he doesn't mention the Combine again until he and McMurphy are drunk on the ward. It is here that he begins to wonder whether or not the Combine is all-powerful, and finally when hitchhiking he "[gives] him such a good story about me being a prfessional Indian wrestler the syndicate had tried to lock up in a nuthouse." Sure he could just be referring to a wrestling syndicate, but he still said syndicate no combine, I think that this, not him escaping from the ward, truly symbolizes him fully regaining his sanity.

Insanity

As I was beginning the reading, I came to the part of the story in which Nurse Ratched gives McMurphy the shock treatment.  The first day he doesn't respond the way Ratched hopes.  So she tries the same thing the next day.  It once again fails.  The third day it fails.  And so on.  This repetition made me wonder, when Kesey wrote this scene did he think back to Albert Einstein's famous quote, "Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results".

Mr. Turkle

McMurphy asked Turkle to wake him and Sandy up right before the morning staff arrives. This however, never happened. Do you think it was just because Turkle was drunk and high, or was there more to it?

test

Response to Trey's "friends vs pawns"

I think McMurphy organized the fishing trip for everyone's benefit. I think he wanted to gain the support of the other patients by giving them something they never dreamed was possible. Also, I think he is using the trip as a chance to reaffirm his own existance by showing himself that there is a world outside of the world of the ward that he has become absorbed into. He is killing two birds with one stone by giving them confidence and gaining their support. I think he views the others as his friends, but at the same time is using them to enact change in the ward.

friends vs pawns

Do you think the fishing trip is for Mcmurphy's benefit or the patients confidence? Does he view the others as friends, or pawns to his manipulation ?

In Responce To Cody's "McMurphy on the Fishing Trip"

I believe that McMurphy is still being selfish, as he has been throughout the entire novel. While he faces a dilemma, weather to stay at the hospital or not, he weighs his options and his selfishness takes over him. McMurphy stays at the hospital because it is benefiting him financially, again showing his own selfishness of taking advantage of everyone there.

Laughter

"While McMurphy laughs. Rocking farther and farther backward against the cabin top, spreading his laugh out across the water..."
through out the fishing trip McMurphy laughter i feel expresses his sanity and his only escape from the pain he is truly feeling and the the insanity that the Big Nurse drives out of him. It his laughter that keeps everyone going since he is one of the first to express it towards the patients but as he goes back to the hospital i just wonder how much longer can he hold out until he is actually free from all this? Since the time is on Big Nurse side im beginning to wonder if he will ever grow insane from waiting?

McMurphy on the Fishing Trip

During the fishing trip, McMurphy had many opportunities to escape the group and be out of the hospital for good. The patients were only accompanied by the doctor as supervision, who McMurphy could easily have overpowered. Why do you believe McMurphy decided not to make an attempt at escape? And are his motives selfish or selfless?

Society and the hospital

It seems as if society has made the people in the hospital seem as if they are horrible people and that they should be feared by all of society, and the outside world. All of the people on the outside dont understand how most of the people in the hospital are in there by choice and that they are somewhat ok, but just have minor problems and that they are afraid of the world. McMurphy also sees that being in the hospital gives him some power over the people on the outside because they are afraid of them.

Fishing Trip

McMurphy has planned this deep sea fishing trip for ten patients. The Nurse is allowing them to get out and possibly have a good time for once. Do you think this trip will go as planned, to just have a nice day of fishing or will Mcmurphy and the patients decide on a different plan? If the fishing trip doesnt work out will Nurse Ratched deal out severe punishment or just suspend any further trips outside of the ward?

women good?

so far in the novel we have seen women torment men and cause their downfalls. now, with the arrival of the prostitute, there seems to be new life in the men. their spirits seem higher, and they are confident enough to approach her and try to impress her. is mcmurphy responsible for these men's actions? will ratched allow this to fly?

Response to McMurphy's Face

This quote took me by surprise as well. As i was reading it, I almost thought it was the chief's face that looked "dreadfully tired and strained and frantic," until i read it again. This is obvious forshadowing of what is to come. It also makes me think about McMurphy's motives, whether he is in fact a selfish man acting like he cares about the others, or he does want to help the patients. In the following chapter, the patients talk about this a lot because the Nurse has told them of how he has been making money, while they are all loosing theirs.

McMurphy's Face

"A set of taillights going past lit up McMurphy's face, and the windshield reflected an expression that was allowed only because he figured it'd be too dark for anybody in the car to see, dreadfully tired and strained and frantic, like there wasn't enough time left for something he had to do...." (257-258). This sentence made me stop for a second; McMurphy is showing weakness, something that I don't think anyone expected him to show. Is he growing tired and fading away like Nurse Ratched expected him to, or is there some deeper going on? Do you think this thing he doesn't have time left for involves the Chief?

Laughter

While at the gas station all the men seemed defeated by the seemingly over-powering attendants. Just as everyone, even the doctor, seemed to be depressed and feeling defeated McMurphy came to the rescue. He sticks up to the attendant and gives everyone a sense of confidence and even hope. After all the patients even start bossing the attendants around they drive away, laughing, but not yet a real laugh. "I think McMurphy knew better than we did that our tough looks were all show, because he still wasn't able to get a real laugh out of anybody." Why is it that even when the patients are able to be a "boss" to someone else they still can not laugh for real? Also while on the boat everyone breaks into laughter and there is no mention if it is real of fake laughs. Do you feel this out-break of laughter was filled with real laughs, and if so what made this situation different then the first where the men were able to laugh for real.

Response to Mike Frieber's...

You bring up a very interesting point and I agree with you and your argument. The same way in which The Beatles, Elvis Presley, and Jimi Hendrix went against societies norms, McMurphy is doing the same. By not just conforming to the asylums rules and regulations he is bending them, nearly braking them, being a rebel. In doing so the other members of the asylum are beginning to take notice as I believe that they too will begin to change more and more as the novel reaches its end. This has already been seen by the Chief talking, Billy no longer writing in the log book about his 'daily observations', and even Martini breaking the glass with the basketball. In order for all of this to have happened, McMurphy had to go against his new societies (the asylum) norms. Good point Mike.

Chief turned away

I found it really interesting when the Chief suddenly began to talk to Mcmurphy but it was even more interesting that the following morning when he was supposed to sweep the hallway like usual he just walked away and said basically that he was "better than that."  To me this seemed like a completely new side of Chief because for him to be left unnoticed he would need to maintain his normal routine around the staff but this was a clear act of defiance.  What does everyone else think about this?

Fairness on the Ward

The patients greatly rely on McMurphy for many things-confidence, fun, a leader, and even a scape goat.  But McMurphy is also using the patients for his advantage, as well.  He is slowly luring Chief out of his fog, and even getting him to speak so he can lift the control panel in the tub room.  He is also being permitted on a fishing trip because of his stronger power over some of the Acutes.  But is this a fair relationship or is one side taking more advantage of the other?

A New Sense of Confidence

When the men leave the ward to go on the fishing trip they are all a little depressed at first. However, I found it interesting how they all gained a new sense of confidence when McMurphy stands up to the gas attendant. Soon they are ordering everyone at the station around and mocking people when they reach stop lights.  I found it interesting that the Chief thought the more insane you act the more people fear you.  

Dr. Spivey Grows A Spine

McMurphy's rebellion seems to inspire the doctor as well as the patients. However, it was established earlier in the story that even if the doctor were to stand up to the Big Nurse in a meaningful way, the Nurse could have him fired on suspicion of being a drug addict. Doctor Spivey is almost certainly aware of this, yet he still helps McMurphy to take the patients on a fishing trip. Why? (Aside from hormones)

Society Defines The Outcasts or The Outcasts Define Society?

I was just thinking about the Insane Asylum and how the "combine" works, trying to make the patients more acceptable for society, even if they are just a little bit "off" or a little more radical than the average person.  And while I was thinking about this, I realized that a lot of the time, it is exactly those people that are a little bit "off" who don't conform to society's norms that are sometimes revered by society.  Elvis Presley albums were burned because his movements were too vulgar for a decent society.  Beatles albums were thrown into the streets because John Lennon made a comment regarding religion that was inappropriate for common society. Jimi Hendrix was made famous just because he DID something different from society. He led the free love movement of the late 1960s from the neck of his guitar.  I guss, In order to change society, you can't be part of it.